need help with turning build.

[CrunchX]

Can you "turn undead" a palemaster? I think you should be able to but i'm guessing you can't...

[Ihavenofeet]

First this is quite an interesting build, would love to see it played out. and second "no" u cant turn pale's. they get undead abilities but never actually get the "undead" racial type.

[CrunchX]

Ihavenofeet said:

First this is quite an interesting build, would love to see it played out. and second "no" u cant turn pale's. they get undead abilities but never actually get the "undead" racial type.

I think they should be really undead at level 10, so they couldn't use any type of healing potions, can get turned by clerics etc... but I don't know all of the D&D rules about these things.

[Astragoth]

Thx for all the replies.

At CrunchX:
thx for the weapon suggestion! That's the only one i've heared so far. Has anyone else got any suggestions on this?
considering the build: I think it is rather clear that you do not see this as a very powerfull build. That is ok, but this build will be PvM only. I totally dislike ALL forms of PVP, unless there are overwhelming roleplaying reasons for it. Above that, this is a build with a large focus on roleplaying, wich is why the character history preceeds the build. Within this limitation I want to make a build that is as effective as possible at the things my character likes to do. I hope feedback will be given with that in mind. I'm not looking for a divine warrior with divine shield, divine might or dev crits. Crits are useless because undead are immune to it. And undead are my target.

At Addicted to rpg:
correct me if I'm wrong, but my 6th level already contains a powerfull offensive spell: blade barrier. wich is also evocation, allows no save, and doesn't seem to have a levelcap. Why would I need chain lightning then? picture this: I turn, and the undead flee directly away from me against the wall at the far end of the room. They stand there against the wall for ten rounds with just one desire... GET AWAY FROM THAT SCARY CLERIC. how about planting a blade barrier beneath their feet? the barrier will deal 1d6 per level for 36 rounds (har har, that is 36*36 d6 damage) with no save!

AT wierdness:
look at this. My turning check will be D20 + D6 + 14(cha modifier with +12 cha item) wich means my turning check will be minimum of 16, a average of 28 and a max of 40. This means I will ALWAYS turn my level + 2, wich equals level 40 undead or golems or outsiders. I need a roll of 6 on a d6+d20 to turn my level +4, wich is the maximum I can turn. The numbers of mobs I turn are 2d6 + 1d4 + 38 + 14 wich means I will turn a MINIMUM of 55 level 40 undead. Always. No save. No failure. how many hitdice does a demi lich have?

At phoenix: That seems to be a powerfull argument to drop the spell focus feats... but do not forget I do not do pvp. Are you saying my spells will go through against mobs anyhow or that they will always make there save regardless the spell focus feats? And if I drop those feats wich would you advice? maximize spell and still spell perhaps?

again thx for all he feedback, keep em coming. I'm still looking for ways to improve the undead hunter and answers to my two questions:

wich weapon should i focus in?

how does smite evil work?

[CrunchX]

Astragoth said:

correct me if I'm wrong, but my 6th level already contains a powerfull offensive spell: blade barrier. wich is also evocation, allows no save, and doesn't seem to have a levelcap. Why would I need chain lightning then? picture this: I turn, and the undead flee directly away from me against the wall at the far end of the room. They stand there against the wall for ten rounds with just one desire... GET AWAY FROM THAT SCARY CLERIC. how about planting a blade barrier beneath their feet? the barrier will deal 1d6 per level for 36 rounds (har har, that is 36*36 d6 damage) with no save!

Blade barrier has a reflex save for half damage, i'm 99% sure of that.

[Astragoth]

funny NWN@gamebanshee lists the spell as having no save.

[W(ie-ei)rdness]

Demiliches are different in the fact that they have +20 to turning resistance. I forget the HD number, but I think you can turn them.

However, you know, the ability to turn aberations is also a good one... I wonder what classification the warped are.

[JoScMa]

correct me if I'm wrong, but my 6th level already contains a powerfull offensive spell: blade barrier. wich is also evocation, allows no save, and doesn't seem to have a levelcap. Why would I need chain lightning then? picture this: I turn, and the undead flee directly away from me against the wall at the far end of the room. They stand there against the wall for ten rounds with just one desire... GET AWAY FROM THAT SCARY CLERIC. how about planting a blade barrier beneath their feet? the barrier will deal 1d6 per level for 36 rounds (har har, that is 36*36 d6 damage) with no save!

There is actually an error in the spell description for Blade Barrier. It only goes up to a max of 20d6 pts of damage for 1 round/caster level. It cannot go up to 40d6 for a lvl 40 cleric. I know this because I tested it with a 26 lvl cleric with maximized Blade Barrier and when targets fail their save, the blade barrier does 120 pts of damage not 156 pts as the description led you to believe.

[Astragoth]

thx Joscma. So basically the spell is almost identical to cl apart from the source of damage (slashing vs elctrical)

Talking to an expirienced pallie leaves me to believe that wf long sword is an exellent choice.

If i drop spell focus I will have 3 feats three. I might fill them up then with maximize spell, and the epic spells hell ball and greater ruin.

[addicted2rpg]

ditto on the blade barrier comments. I want to point out that most spells in NWN don't exceed Lvl 20 in power or for their damage calculations, with the exception of Horrid Wilting which caps at 25 (I double checked the spell script for it too so I can verify that).

Dispel might be a bone of contention in here, but it is going to change in 1.63 (it is on the list of fixes), so I'm holding my cards until after then.

I really think that is a cool Turner. For RP purposes, Sun domain is a good take vs. undead. For your second domain, choose one that optimizes turning for the largest number of potential creatures

Warped: humans, elves, halflings, half-orcs.... sorry folks, no outsiders

[Xiloscient]

I'd also like to point out that the ref save for half on blade barrier... is not effected at all by evasion and improved evasion... So in a way it is.. ((At lvl 20 caster level)) 10d6 no save ((Everyone will make there save anyways)) This is accualy one of the only uses of 9th level cleric spells as everyone is immune to death.. so drop the 3 evocation +dc's and drop a maximize...

I also would personally change the starting stats from this char... lower the wisdom to 16 and up the con by 4 and the dex by 2. The only way that starting a stat at 18 ((which is hella expensive)) is if it is a single stat char... such as rogues((dex monkeys)) and wizards((Int monkeys)) Anytime you'll be focusing on 2 or more... 16 is plenty high... and you don't have to sacrifise a perma 80 hp 2 fort save and 1 ac. ((Which you'll be gaining from the 4con/2dex))

On weapon selection... I would definetly go for the holy bastard sword.. ((Which is also a holy avenger)) It does plenty of divine/elemental and would still allow for a shield ((+12 ac = good )) The only real reason to use a 2 handed weapon is so that you get 1.5 times your str bonus to damage.. and not just 1 times your str with a single handed weapon...

Another note.. HellBall...
SUCKS!!!
So drop the 3 evocations... take Maximized Spell to make use of 9th level spells.. Take Exotic Weapon Profieciency.. to use that beast of a pally sword... ((Which I'll even make you one if you'd like)) And get greater ruin... just cuase it is accualy a good spell..
I'm sure I could go on and get picky but I won't.

[Phoenix]

Are you saying my spells will go through against mobs anyhow or that they will always make there save regardless the spell focus feats?

That's hard to answer, I picked the feats with Phoenix, so I don't know if they really helped. I was aiming for the PvP side of things, which is close to a lost cause with all the + to save items. As far as mobs, not sure, but your going to be turning everything under the sun so who cares?

If you can get exotic weapon feat do that, best weapons are there. I like max. over empower, but don't forget the benefits of getting both, and having more freedom with spell selection (you could choose to max instead of empower for a different level).

[Astragoth]

If I follow xilo's advice I need to drop two more feats to get great wis 5 & 6 (gr wis 6 is in fact optional but would leave me at 25 wis). The feats I have to drop are possibly weapon focus and epic weapon focus. Can I afford to miss the +3 to attack?

edit: since it is really easy to get two more points of dex I'll bump up int to 10 so I get a third skill... prolly take pally level at lelvel 20 to get 23 discipline and put 20 cross class in tumble.

The character would look like this:

str 8 | 8
dex 10 | 10
con 14 | 14
int 10 | 10
wis 16 | 26
cha 16 | 26

1 paladin (exotic weapon proficiency, toughness)
2 cleric (sun domain, destruction domain)
3 cleric (spell penetration)
4 cleric (wis +1)
5 paladin
6 paladin (extra smite)
7 cleric
8 cleric (cha +1)
9 cleric (empower spell)
10 paladin
11 all cleric levels from now on
12 (extend spell, cha +1)
15 (greater spell penetration)
16 (cha +1)
18 (maximize spell)
20 (wis +1)
21 (great CHA I)
23 (great WIS I)
24 (great CHA II, cha +1)
26 (great WIS II)
27 (great CHA III)
28 (wis +1)
29 (great WIS III)
30 (great CHA IV)
32 (great WIS IV, cha +1)
33 (great WIS V)
35 (great WIS VI)
36 (planar turning, wis +1)
38 (epic spell penetration)
39 (epic spell: greater ruin)
40 (cha +1)

any thoughts?

[Phoenix]

Try to end important stats on even numbers, if you really can't hit 26, stop at 24. Also with tumble, make sure to subtract your armour penalty and have that end on something divisible by 5. Each 5 points=1 AC, but that's after armour check. So if you armour is -9, stop at 19 so you have a 10 total.

[Astragoth]

phoenix, for planar turning cha and wis 25 are required unfortunately.

I build the cleric in DebugMode and noticed I made a mistake. I don't get cleric bonus feats until I have 20 cleric levels. This means the character will end up with one feat less, wich is gr WIS 6, and my character will end with 25 wis at level 40.

As far as I am aware of the bonus to AC from tumble comes from having 5 ranks as opposed to the skillvalue, so armorcheck will not apply.

The character will have an attack of +49 / +44 / +39 / +34 after divinepower, bulls strenght, battletide and divine favour. As of now I'm inclined to forego discipline and tumble and take 33 ranks of taunt. Or do you guys think that with my cha modifier less ranks will be required to reach the maximum of -6 AC on the monster?