Subrace cap

[Ihavenofeet]

Subraces are an excellent addition, and i enjoy playin my half-celestial but how come the racial mods to stats apply to the +12 cap, i mean no other race has that so why the subraces?

[MitzaVolchenko]

*grumbles in agreement*

Having grumbled, I switch hats and remind everyone that a) subraces are a pain the rump, period. There is a discalimer in the thread where subraces are discussed under Important Info and b) in addition to stat bonuses, most subraces get other nifty things that make them good from a pure build stand point c) the only real reason to take a subrace is for RP, in my opinion. Some of our basic human builds can take any subrace on the server.

[Spathic]

they stat bonuses are nice but thats not the real reason to go 1/2 celestial... the way i see it, those stat bonuses make the early leveling bearable... but when you consider how soon you can start taking lower high-end creatures (invis stalkers, liches,etc.,) it outweighs the negatives...

also consider that those ECL levels don't really count (you can still hit level 40) theres really not much to complain about...

[Silentus]

Footless, I believe the reason is simply that the subraces are not built in to the base engine but are a community built entity. The engine says you can only have +12 to a stat but the built in races get thier bonuses native to the engine, so the cap can apply after the modified base. The sub-races come in above the base engine, so thier bonuses cannot be modified till after the engine has looked at them so they are restricted by that cap.

[Phoenix]

Actually, I think the subraces could be fixed, but I'm no code monkey. The reason is this, the subraces were out pre HoU, I'm pretty sure they were out pre SoU. Anyways, they didn't have the commands in the toolset to modify the base number w/o making the server see it as an invalid character.

So fast forward to today and we have RDDs. Now there has to be some method/command/switch that was added to make these charactes legal with their increased str. and whatnot adding to their base, not like an enchanted bonus. So if this same command/method/whatever was used to update the subraces, voilla. Again, I'm no code monkey.

Even that would have problems though, because we could have 1/2dragon/RDDs getting +16 to nat. str.
You could have like a 60 strength, easy.

[Ihavenofeet]

But my point is PnP 1/2 celestial INCLUDES the subrace stats in the ECL, not to mention a coupla other beni's with 1/2 celestial and 1/2 fiend (spells and such) get. The Subrace is fun to RP, thats a reason why i brought Ian from PnP to NWN. Dnt get me wrong, if the powers that be shut the idea down im still gonna Smite the !@#$ outta evil cuz well....its fun.

[AvengersWraith]

Becareful what you wish for, if Makz makes the stat bonuses to your character sheet, you will not be able to use that character, it is an illegal character by NWN standards.

It clearly states that if you want the sub-race pros, you must also accept the sub-race cons.

Somewhere down the line if Bioware and WotC keep business relations going, in future expansion packs sub-races and more prestige classes will be added, as well as spells and other nifty tools for the builders to make better worlds.

There is so much potential with NWN, but it will take a decade or more if Bioware and WotC want to do it right. To release a huge bundle at one time and then have to take years to fix all the bugs will turn players off, whereas, if they do a little bit each year they can work on quality product which is what me and many other players want. Another reason to add small amounts at one time, so the customers do not have to make a lot of PC upgrading at one time to be able to continue with a growing platform. But these are mostly my opinions.

[Makzimia]

Dead end, discussion over

Makz.