taylor
Elder
S is for Shurikens
Posts: 145
|
Post by taylor on Aug 9, 2004 12:47:09 GMT
it occured to me that some serious power building goes on as i was talking to someone who shall remain anonymous unless they feel fit to mention it. but is there anyway to put a script on the jail doors for escaping such as you only get 1 attempt and only people with the epic rogue feat for escaping. i know how fiddly scripts are, horrible stuff but you know think about it, anyone want to look up the scripts required for it? i know nothing about scripts and when someone mentions script stuff i go boggle eyed. sorry for not being much use  |
|
|
|
Post by Radog on Aug 9, 2004 15:56:44 GMT
I agree there should only be one attempt as some rogue builds have so many points in lockpick that is very simple to pick the lock and walk right out of jail if they are not being guarded. Those who can escape easily are making a mockery out of the justice system and weakening its impact on crime. But it sounds like a scripting issue and Makz said something to the effect about Addicted being swamped with other stuff so we will see how it plays out. Also on a side note to the jail thing, the jail penalties need to be harsher and so do the execution penalties, there are a few people with rap sheets a mile long and continue to commit crimes because they dont care. Interested in hearing ideas on that as well....
|
|
taylor
Elder
S is for Shurikens
Posts: 145
|
Post by taylor on Aug 9, 2004 16:19:43 GMT
it isnt just rogues unfortunately,
but it think the punishments are fine they are just being mocked and degraded by all the people escaping
|
|
|
|
Post by Silentus on Aug 9, 2004 17:04:21 GMT
I agree there should only be one attempt as some rogue builds have so many points in lockpick that is very simple to pick the lock and walk right out of jail if they are not being guarded. Those who can escape easily are making a mockery out of the justice system and weakening its impact on crime. But it sounds like a scripting issue and Makz said something to the effect about Addicted being swamped with other stuff so we will see how it plays out. Also on a side note to the jail thing, the jail penalties need to be harsher and so do the execution penalties, there are a few people with rap sheets a mile long and continue to commit crimes because they dont care. Interested in hearing ideas on that as well.... I agree about the jail locking issue (I believe a max security prison is in order). As far as the penalties though I fully disagree. We had that massive discussion in February and came to the punishments we currently use for the most part. That was after a boatload of consideration and voting. If you wish to revisit the trhreads, its all still out there. If memory serves, they adhered to the punishments types pretty well, though what consititutes a crime got modified somewhat in real play. |
|
|
|
Post by JoScMa on Aug 9, 2004 17:15:24 GMT
I agree. I was the one talking to Taylor about it. I have seen several builds out there that have 1 rogue level tacked on to the end with maxed out lock pick skill. I remember Addicted telling me that this idea was that only epic rogues should be able to pick the locks. Apparently, people are getting around that since all the players who are creating PC's who intend to cause trouble take this one level of rogue just to get out of jail easily. By the time a knight arrests someone and they get to the jail, the jailed PC is already out and running away. Makes the jail a joke. So why would I even bother arresting these individuals who can easily get out before I can even run to the jail?
|
|
|
|
Post by Phoenix on Aug 9, 2004 17:17:53 GMT
Honestly... The jail doors are hard enough. It takes, what, 74 to open them. That's no fly-by-night locksmith.
Having been involved in many jail breaks, and seeing the relativly few escapes (check the crime logs, it's not that rampant, less than 10%), nothing should be done.
No, those who are getting arrested are already making a mockery of the system, that's why they are breaking the law... Maybe you should give better attention to these 'people who can escape' beyond using the lasso (which BTW, I treat as being teleported). IE take someone down, tie them up (we are talking RP issues, not character issue right?), take their possesions, and walk their happy butts down to jail.
I, for one, could not escape without my equipment, I doubt anyone without the epic skill foucs-open locks could either.
Simple solution is to take their gear.
Supermax is no fun.
This was also the same argument that got lassos/ written laws were invented, crime is WAY down from there, so we have a system, use it.
You want less crime, increase the knights/patrols.
edit: I have the one level of rogue tacked on at the end, but no matter HOW you slice it, that's 1 level in my build (obviously has other benefits) and 40+ skill points. Nothing to brush off, I could have used those skill points elsewhere, say PP or spot, which I didn't max out... On top of all that, I'm mostly wizard who gets the most skill points other than a rogue. So if my build 'feels' the pain of dropping all those points into OL, it still has a cost, more-so for other builds
|
|
|
|
Post by JoScMa on Aug 9, 2004 18:34:26 GMT
Hard enough? The doors were meant for epic rogues to break out of (Addicted even told me), not a build with a level of rogue tacked on to the end. Best solution, either raise the DC to a point where a character must have high Dex bonus (even with equipment) or have some scripting involved, only allowing epic rogues (and other classes with lockpick as a class skill) to pick the lock.
And Phoenix, when I was last on as Xyon, you were already out of the cell. I don't call that being hard to break out of jail.
|
|
|
|
Post by ride on Aug 9, 2004 19:06:01 GMT
i think maybe the jail should be upgraded (given enough time for dev...) to be the original incarnation: the jails as they are but with SCRIPTED guards so that the knights do not have to run over there to watch (if ported by lasso) or have some immediate help to try and thwart the jailbreak attempt, if say another knight is not available. I also think the taking away of equipment is a good place to start in the meantime... I agree with phoenix that there are probably not alot of PC's out there that could break the jails locks without extra gear of some kind (I know of one little rogue that can do it ( least I *think* he could.. hell maybe even Ventrick couldn't break those doors without gear... dang it now I can't remember exactly....  )) |
|
|
|
Post by Makzimia on Aug 9, 2004 19:08:58 GMT
Bump to addicted: add code to check class feat epic rogue. However IMO, 74 lock pick is a LOT of skill points  and if a player is willing to spend that, and you don't need to be a rogue for that BTW, then well... Makz. |
|
|
|
Post by Minstrel67 on Aug 9, 2004 19:58:20 GMT
How about this, place a Keehar stone inside the jail so that the knights can port there after lasso'ing someone and then be almost instantly available as guards
Minstrel
|
|
|
|
Post by JoScMa on Aug 9, 2004 23:45:13 GMT
That will make it too easy for people who want to break people out... although a special item that ports knights directly to the jail could be manifested instead.
|
|
|
|
Post by Minstrel67 on Aug 10, 2004 1:11:55 GMT
That's actually what I meant but I was rushed when I typed it and didn't make that point...  |
|
|
|
Post by Phoenix on Aug 10, 2004 9:09:12 GMT
44(skill points)+13(skill focus/epic focus)+d20=77 44(skill points)+10(dex, natural)+d20=74 There is your epic locksmith and high dex builds. Anything less *requires equipment*, which isn't exactly what you are asking for, but very possible with just a hair for RPing on your end. Also, proof is in the pudding. Did anyone bother to actually look at the crime report logs? makzimia.proboards19.com/index.cgi?board=crimereport&action=display&thread=1077645852I counted about 7, since we have just had 100 convictions, that makes only 7%... By that defination, it's 'easy' for anyone with enough skill points. The only reason you say that is because I did have enough, and it only takes, what, 6 seconds to open a lock. It almost sounds like you don't want anyone getting out, to me, that's more a form of player punishment, not character punishment. Again, 74DC is not easy. You build a character to do it, and be effective against monsters so you can level, and be effective in PvP if you want to RP that way (the things that lead to jail lead to PvP). It's a lot of effort, no matter how you get there. Either way you slice it, it's the highest DC in the game on anything. |
|
|
|
Post by JoScMa on Aug 10, 2004 9:27:47 GMT
Don't try to twist my words around. There is no point in arresting people such as you if you can escape before guards can get to the prison.
|
|
|
|
Post by Makzimia on Aug 10, 2004 9:32:02 GMT
WOW BOY!!! cool down  there would be some that can escape that easy for real anyway... that is why some people in the past would have been captured and executed after a certain number of escapes in the old days, perhaps that is what it is required, *IF* agreed to by the player. I don't see that being viable. However, I do see merit in making a feat check for it as well as the DC, it makes it more realistic, and, BTW, there is a Maximum security, and some have been there, its used for OOC crimes Makz. |
|
))
"There are only three sports--mountain climbing, bullfighting, and motor racing--all the rest being games." Ernest Hemingway 
and if a player is willing to spend that, and you don't need to be a rogue for that BTW, then well...
there would be some that can escape that easy for real anyway... that is why some people in the past would have been captured and executed after a certain number of escapes in the old days, perhaps that is what it is required, *IF* agreed to by the player. I don't see that being viable. However, I do see merit in making a feat check for it as well as the DC, it makes it more realistic, and, BTW, there is a Maximum security, and some have been there, its used for OOC crimes 