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Post by Radog on Mar 10, 2004 8:36:25 GMT
I have seen this played out a few times and I thought I would post to get some opinions. Most of you have seen the scenario; Bad guy does something bad, runs off and comes back into town with a different color robe/armor and a helmet and suddenly he is the master of disguise, nobody is supposed to have a clue to who he is. Now, from a very strict RP sense, you can't read the name on top of the PC, you have to deduce their indentity some other way, the most common way being to look at their face. But let us suppose they have a helmet on, or changed their clothes or armor, then what is acceptable to deduce the identity? Build? Voice? Tatoo's? Height? Posture? Should a PC with a high CHA modifier be able to pull it off (disguise) better than others? Or what about a PC who has high INT or WIS, should they be able to see through to the PC behind the disguise better? Should a bluff check have to take place? I dont mind the whole disguise thing as a bit of RP, but the whole concept is starting to get abused by people who want to act evil and not face the consequences. So I would like to hear as many opinions as possible....I will chime in on mine later in the post...  |
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Post by kline on Mar 10, 2004 8:58:36 GMT
Hey raddog ask people to start taking off there helmets in town for a moment to see there face then they can put there helmet back on. Tell them there is a wanted criminal around and he has about there build. Now if they leave looking like a halfing and come back looking like a orc I dont think you sould have cause to bother that person.
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Hanah
Elder
Hanah Dedraluin<br>Kether<br>Verine Odama
Posts: 203
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Post by Hanah on Mar 10, 2004 9:55:28 GMT
While I'm not super-familiar with the 3E rules, I would think a bluff check by the disguiser may be appropriate.... after all it takes some poise and self-awareness to 'be someone else', right, which would be a CHA-related ability.
Now on the other hand, how does someone perceive... I would lean towards something WIS-related, maybe spot? Seeing a little flash of a well-known scar, or noting a distinctive posture... these would all be tell-tale signs for the observant.
Perhaps someone with more knowledge with the book rules could supply some insight though!
Hanah
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Post by Silentus on Mar 10, 2004 9:59:06 GMT
I have 2 points to bring up here:
1. To further Klines idea, Knights could have a standing order that all in town must have thier faces exposed - I dont like the idea IC, but OOC it would simplify things.
2. When the game fails, consult PnP rules. Pg 67 in the 3rd Ed PHB bascially says that disguise is an opposition check of Suspects Disguise vs Knights Spot, modified for quality of disguise and familiarity of suspect. Problem is that we dont have a disguise skill in the game. Perhaps instead modifiers for Chr + Int + Wis +1d20 vs Spot + 1d20 or something? These numbers could be anything, but those kinda made sence to me.
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Post by Makzimia on Mar 10, 2004 14:36:51 GMT
WOOOOOOOOOAH horsies! before this runs away like some other threads, I think I should input here... I realise that the ex PnP crowd want to put everything into rolls and thereby feel comfy that everything is defined, but do you want to know why I keep saying this server was not strictly RP?  for this very reason... you are taking the fun out of playing a game... a computer game... hell even I wouldn't want to play on this server if it became that way. Sit back, stop looking in your book, and think of ways just to do something out of your head instead, and if the other player agrees to it... alright, if not, walk away. Play! have fun! Makz. |
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Post by ride on Mar 10, 2004 16:31:00 GMT
I realise that the ex PnP crowd want to put everything into rolls and thereby feel comfy that everything is defined, but do you want to know why I keep saying this server was not strictly RP? for this very reason... you are taking the fun out of playing a game... a computer game... hell even I wouldn't want to play on this server if it became that way. Sit back, stop looking in your book, and think of ways just to do something out of your head instead, and if the other player agrees to it... alright, if not, walk away. Play! have fun! Makz.  I agree.... it does seem that lately this aspect is getting *way* outta hand.... |
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Post by AvengersWraith on Mar 10, 2004 17:39:52 GMT
Is the helmet worn during the crime a totally different shape than the current helmet?
Did they switch from cloth armor to metal?
Are they now carrying a staff instead of a sword?
Has it only been more than 10 minutes of real time?
Is the criminal well known?
If you and the disguised person feel a dice roll is in order, they start with 0 get +4 for every yes except ont he last question which gives a -10 and then make a d20 roll, bards can make a perform check since they dabble in the mysterious art of theatre anyways.
Otherwise, "kill them all and lot God sort them out" as the ignorant say.
I, myself, think a knight should determine how well a disguise is and if the knight feels the disguise is borderline he has the option to resort to a die roll.
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Post by Preedy1978 on Mar 10, 2004 19:17:19 GMT
Good call Avenger...i had this situation the other day.
What i did was look at the change of costume, and thought quickly about if my Char would be fooled.
In this incident i decided no...the disguise was far too lame lol. Shame...because i liked the idea, and told the player so via tell...
Lets all keep this simple and use common sense. If the disguise is reasonable, then it should be AOK, with a quick roll check if they speak etc.. although if the disguise is borderline, or rubbish even, then it dont work.
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Post by Silentus on Mar 11, 2004 23:37:45 GMT
LOL, MAkz, I think maybe you misunderstand me. I dont think anyone here is really talking about trying to make any rules about this stuff. More ideas for those who want to use them. I frequently use a die or 2 at my desk. Simple thing is that with Vugor, theres alot of stuff I think of that he just plain isnt capable of. I want some odds, but dont want to use the online toos cuz the people online wont care, but if someone calls me on playing Vugor a little too smart, I know I ran it fair. (keeps me in check too ) Similarly, usually if there is something that the NWN game cant account for, I come up with some kind of logical odds in my head and roll a die or 2. If Im playing with hardcore people, I try to follow the PnP rules. If Im playing with fast and loose types, I totally make it up so no time is wasted. I was puttting up stats for those HCR types, but I would never want to see that enforced - eesh! ;D |
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Post by Phoenix on Mar 11, 2004 23:49:08 GMT
I like the idea of -optional- rule from Pnp to resolve creative RPs. That's why they are there in PnP, but I say optional because I think its something for the players to hash out themselves, like we are doing here. Disguises are awesome RPs, if not overused (like all good excuses, cry wolf too much...) we should encourage them. The idea of removing your helm to see who you are is a great suggestion, and involves no dice rolls too! However, asking people to not have a defense item on in a busy area such as W. Styne is asking for things, and you think it's hard to get people to put up their weapons! HA! Just wait until everyone gets hit with a mind spell and watch those helms get put right back on. |
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for this very reason... you are taking the fun out of playing a game... a computer game... hell even I wouldn't want to play on this server if it became that way. Sit back, stop looking in your book, and think of ways just to do something out of your head instead, and if the other player agrees to it... alright, if not, walk away. Play! have fun!
I agree.... it does seem that lately this aspect is getting *way* outta hand....
"There are only three sports--mountain climbing, bullfighting, and motor racing--all the rest being games." Ernest Hemingway 
